I'm having a really hard time getting into this game cause I read forums like morning paper, lol.

But these are so inactive compared to the online numbers, and it just feels... dispersed. Forums are meant to create little community bubbles and that's just not happening. Sparse little discussions here and there, but I'm not seeing anything, really.

I realize the Discord is where everyone is, but I simply can't participate in it. I feel a pretty intense FOMO just missing out on the majority of community activity. It's like I'm all alone here and it really turns me off. I have a hard time feeling welcome, as community is a huge factor for me with these games.

Would the devs ever consider combatting this a little, you think? Perhaps not plastering the Discord on the front page, and instead adding a forums widget. Maybe if they more actively posted in the forums. Maybe if there were forum events like contests.

I don't know! If I were in charge I'd just shut the Discord down so people actually play the game itself and spend time here, but I realize that's a tall ask.

I also just don't really understand it. Doesn't spending time on a third party software actively take away from the ad revenue? Wouldn't clicking through bustling forums help generate ad revenue for Lorwolf?

I'd post this to the suggestions but I'd like more community discussion here before I do so because I'm wondering if I'm alone. I'm also just pretty intimidated of being immediately shot down at the suggestion of encouraging migration, and wanna know if I'm reasonable?

Yeah, the discord is always going to be at odds with the forums, and always be taking a huge amount of attention away from the site itself unfortunately, which looks pretty sad and has contributed to some of the bad optics the game gets from reviewers. The best time to nuke it would have been when beta ended and they archived the beta discord. :P

I'm sure there would be a lot of vocal backlash against getting rid of it at this stage, since it's been allowed to exist this long, and I can see a reason for some kind of faster paced chat for certain things. It seems like it would be a good idea to incentivize forum activity more than they have so far though; whether it's disallowing certain types of activity in the discord that would be better for the game to have on the forums (like sales or trades, maybe), or something else.

@Reave honestly at this point I feel the backlash would be short-lived but for the better... like okay people are angry for a week...... then start begrudgingly using the site.

I don't think any solution to this lies in adjusting the discord, but rather incentivizing the forums. Because the thing is that by and large people prefer chatting on discord; it offers quick, easy conversation more akin to real life than forums. It allows for large group, casual conversations like hanging out with a group of friends, whereas forums will always have a slightly higher level of formality and depth to them. And a lot of the time people just want to hang out and have short form conversations with friends than more in-depth discussion like forums tends to promote! (Note: I am using the term 'in-depth' loosely here)

And consider just how many unofficial discords there are for other sites, at least by having an official discord they can keep people redirected back to the site! I think a large part of it is just the culture surrounding forums vs discord and people's general preference for the latter, and regardless of backlash, any removal of the official discord at any point in development would/would have simply prompted the creation of unofficial discords and the problem would probably be largely the same.

So, I don't think adjusting the discord is necessarily going to solve anything, people will just make their own servers and pick up where things left off like nothing happened except now they've also been stung by the devs. I think any form of solution, therefore, lies in encouraging people to use the forums, not discouraging them from using the discord. When people have something they like they're not going to respond well to negative reinforcement against it, they're more likely to respond to positive reinforcement towards the alternative. I say this as an active discord user myself who typically prefers it; you're not going to encourage me to use the forums by slapping my hand every time I go for the discord, you're just going to make me resent you for hitting me.

If we want to see more forum usage we need to find ways to make using the forums more positive, not make using the discord more negative.

Neither here nor there, but part of the reason other noteworthy pet sites have less issue with unofficial discords is in no small part to their much, much larger userbases, the (relatively) late onboarding of those discords -- and the general drama they get up to that fragments them into many smaller groups. >:P An official discord stymies the latter, because people generally fear punitive actions on their actual accounts where they know the mod cops are watching.

@Star Don't worry, you are not alone preferring the forum over Discord. I have too difficulties feeling welcome on bigger discords. I'd say, from my point of view, you are perfectly reasonable. But I also know that suggesting deleting the Discord won't fly very far.

But like @Reave said, we also need some tighter rules on what can go on the Discord and what should be exclusively on the forum. For example, yesterday I posted a bug on the forum only to have someone telling me it was already reported and confirmed on the discord. That felt really off. For me, this kind of thing shouldn't be discussed on the discord and the LW team shouldn't partake in them but redirect them to the forum. And I think other kinds of things should only be done on the forum.

I'm not especially outgoing, but it's easy for me to skim discord and hop in here and there and feel a part of the community. If the official discord were removed, I'd probably just join an unofficial discord or socialize with the players less, which is to say that removing the discord isn't the magical fix. In this recent 6 months of no-update dead time people chatting on discord is most likely the reason the community didn't die out entirely. I still skim the forums, but I strongly prefer discord and I imagine there are many who feel the same. Forum games and contests would probably be a step in the right direction. I do also play a certain dragon based game in the genre with 10x the playerbase and their forums are pretty dead too. I feel like people as a whole prefer the alternatives to forums these days.

My biggest gripe with the forums here personally is the lack of ability to change/edit our posts. Right now, if I want to change the title of a thread I made, I have to request a mod change it for me and while I do genuinely appreciate their time, I'd rather it be something that can be done without assistance. Also I can edit my reply to be a blank post but I can't delete it entirely. These types of things greatly annoy me and I just don't have these problems in discord. So I guess what I am saying is these forums are still lacking in basic features to be enjoyable to use. I'm sure changes and upgrades are on the way and when they come the forums may become more lively.

Yeah, maybe it's just that I've spent 20 years on petsites with forums, or that I just can't be bothered, but all these sites moving to third party channels instead of the sites' actual forums is a major way to kill the community for me. I'm not linking my personal discord to them and can barely stand using even the few ones I'm in as-is, but that means that I miss out on what should be important announcements/bug issues/etc because they weren't ported over here. it's not an issue unique to lorwolf by a long-shot, but it does really make the place seem completely deserted to new players (I thought this place must only have a dozen people online at a time when I joined, I was flabbergasted when I learned the actual numbers) :\

I think a lot of the problems could be solved by using them for different purposes. I don't typically use large Discords. In fact, the only one I'm a part of is the Palia Discord. I feel as though the Discord should be a discussion area. I find it weird to be on an auction forum and see "offer make through Discord" or offers that I can't see. If the forums were specific for trading or if the updates, however minute, were posted on both, then I don't think I would mind the Discord as much. It feels like a majority of the community is on Discord for various purposes ranging from showing off newly found wild wolves to discussing and sneak-peaking new CAs. I don't necessarily have an issue with that, but it does feel a bit bare here with the lack of open discussion.

Also, as a personal comment- it's interesting we have a forum badge for posts, but the forums aren't encouraged? If we're considering it an accomplishment, then why aren't we encouraging it more?

Personally, I think Discord is just a more fast-paced, instant way of connecting with people, especially for the reasons people above have already pointed out, and if they shut the official Discord down there would only be (more) inofficial ones, which 1. scatters people, and 2. has the same result, but without admin/mod presence and control. I don't think shutting it down would solve the problem of dead forums.

I agree with the others that we need to make posting on forums more attractive instead. I've thought about it and (to me) there are three major categories that could help with forum activity:

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1. Polishing the forum experience

Things like editable titles, deletable posts, the quote feature (coming soon), LW-specific emojis to spice up text, or an easier way to embed images (like FR's widgets)

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2. Giving users rewards for posting (but beware possible spam)

Such as earning X (small) amount of pebbles per post, a function to 'like' posts and build up a score that results in rewards at certain milestones, more rewards for number of posts besides the badge, more banners/decorations people want to show off, or maybe a random chance of earning moonstone shards when posting something.

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3. Offering up more content to be posted on

Currently, the forums are off the leash, meaning activity relies on whatever people want to make topics on. Which is not a bad thing, but it would likely help if users were given staff-made threads to interact in on top of the autonomy. Forum games, contests, raffles, themed wolf showcases, events for RL (or better yet, Loria's) holidays, or hey, why not put the NPCs to use? It's a great way for staff to engage the community, which would cut down on the dissent that's been going around during the quiet period, and to get more traffic and activity and user fun out of the forums.

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There are definitely things I like about the forums, but I also definitely think they could use a little more love to really make them shine.

For a while I was avoiding the discord channel because I heavily dislike large fast-paced channels that I can't adequately keep up in. I kept myself here to the forums, but quickly ran out of content since the forums aren't posted on often. I got desperate for interaction on lorwolf to feel like the site was actually alive! So I went to the discord, where it is significantly more active. I tried every other site where lorwolf had some sort of presence and everything else looks dead. The discord and the website are the only two active sources for lorwolf content.

If the discord was removed, however, I at least would make significantly less sales, would have a harder time getting certain recipes, and not get any real advice on CA as I make it. I like having an alternate place to post stuff without being as serious. I don't want to post in the "will this get approved?" CA thread and maybe get an answer when I can just ask someone who knows CA on the discord and they'll tell me within minutes. Also, many recipes just aren't on the flea market, and being able to submit a general "can someone buy me this recipe if they have it?" around the times of the mole market refresh make it much more likely for someone to see it, as opposed to them going to the trades forum and clicking on my specific thread asking for a specific item and then deciding to comment on that thread to ask me about buying it. Do I make a thread for every new item? I can't change forum titles. I'd have to title an item search thread as "items I'm looking to buy!" and whoever looks at that has to make the active choice to read further about what I want as opposed to seeing it at a glance. It just adds a lot of time to really minor comments or posts.

I initially joined the discord in the first place because I was starting to catch pretty wild wolves and wanted to show them off. I thought about making a thread on the wolf share channel, but realized I'd likely get zero responses. There's no preview for images in a thread, so unless the person posting properly titles their thread (I have seen too many wolves I would not call pastel listed as pastel) I'm going in blind. On the wild wolf share thread I can swiftly scroll through and see exactly what I'm looking at without needing to click on a bunch of threads. Not to mention how many people post sales threads without actually linking their wolf, or they post the incorrect den link. The ease of discord has made the forums seem so painfully slow. There's a big difference to me in posting a single message with an image in a chat, as opposed to me starting a thread. I post a pic and can get reactions, even if nobody comments. Forums don't have reactions, or the emojis that make communicating through discord fun. Do I make a new thread for each wild wolf I get? Do I just update "my" thread only? I get a lot less sharing that way and I doubt anybody is going to subscribe to my wolf share thread. Do I find a thread for every other notable wild wolf hunter on this site? Will they make a new thread for every wolf they find notable? I don't like subscribing to threads because I like keeping my notifications for important things (messages and sales) as opposed to getting a notification to check a thread for literally any post, even if it is someone just posting a single word comment. If I find an error, it's so much easier for me to message people and ask "does anyone else have this problem?" before I go wasting the moderators' time by submitting bug reports for things that are either already established, or are errors related to my device and not the site itself. Also, once you've got a bit of a reputation for things, people start pointing out stuff for you to buy that you likely would've never seen otherwise. For example, someone put up an offer for a palindrome they were going to release soon. Someone notified me, and I was able to buy that pup before the original owner released it. I would never ever have found that pup otherwise. The discord helps sales for those in the discord.

I think official news and bug reports need to be kept to the forums, so people have a reason to come back here and don't end up posting something that's novel to the site but established as an issue on discord. People shouldn't be kept out of the loop just because they're not in the discord channel. The discord is definitely taking over, and I feel it should be a side thing for additional interaction instead of the main interaction.

However, I don't think removing the discord will bring everybody back to the forums. It's not a magical mystery cure. Some people won't want to post on the forums because a lot of discord posts just... aren't forum worthy. I see a wild wolf someone posts in the wild wolf hunting channel and I can compliment it there quick and easy, or send an eyes emoji if I'm wanting to buy. And discord doesn't limit the thread to 10 comments per page. I can scroll quickly through and skim for comments left on a particular wolf instead of clicking page after page, constantly reloading my browser. I'm not going to go onto wolf share and comment on every single post, or every single comment inside of a thread where someone has posted a wolf I like. Forums just feel more professional, and I like the casual aspect of the discord. I would never write a post this long in the discord.

I think there's a place for both, but those who aren't in the discord are really getting the short end of the stick. Information shouldn't be sequestered just to the discord, and I know that's a big problem for a lot of people. I don't know how else to fix that except for moderators updating the bug reports thread in a timely manner. People submitting bug reports should look through the known reports and making sure they aren't resubmitting something, but that can only happen if known bugs are updated to the bug report main thread quickly. Also, allowing title edits to forum posts would make me significantly more likely to make threads looking for items or selling wolves.